Semroc

[astronwolf]

Looks like eRockets is discontinuing a lot of Semroc kits. I counted nearly 40 kits that are being phased out.

[Ltvscout]

Sad... :(

[ghrocketman]

I think discontinuing the entire SLS line and the Saturn 1B really stinks.

[A Fish Named Wallyum]

Actually, I think it will clear out room for more new products. In a successful business model you can't keep stuff around if it doesn't sell. I would imagine that if you really had a hankering for one of the kits, eRockets would still stock the parts, just not in kit form.

[astronwolf]

Actually, I think it will clear out room for more new products. In a successful business model you can't keep stuff around if it doesn't sell. I would imagine that if you really had a hankering for one of the kits, eRockets would still stock the parts, just not in kit form.
Yes, Randy has a business to run. Out with the old stuff no one wants, and in with the new. And there is a lot new going on.

[ghrocketman]

I like the way it was ran by the original owners- nothing ever got discontinued, custom parts reasonably priced, etc.
Really wish it would have been possible for Sheryl to continue it on, but totally understand why it could not with Bruce's health.

[K'Tesh]

I like the way it was ran by the original owners- nothing ever got discontinued, custom parts reasonably priced, etc.
Really wish it would have been possible for Sheryl to continue it on, but totally understand why it could not with Bruce's health.

They're not discontinued as in you'll never see them again (and can't find the parts to clone them). They just aren't assembling the parts into kits that aren't moving fast enough to justify their shelf space (e.g. Earmark, which had no sales IINM in 2017, and others that sold only 4 kits (or so) in the same period of time).

If you want something that is OOP and out of stock, just use the instructions (which he's trying to figure out how to archive for free download), and order the parts (including decals) separately.

[ghrocketman]

Ahh.... that's good news if he is keeping all the parts and decals available for them.

[tbzep]

If you want something that is OOP and out of stock, just use the instructions (which he's trying to figure out how to archive for free download), and order the parts (including decals) separately.
Most of the instructions are still available for download on the original SEMROC site.

[K'Tesh]

Most of the instructions are still available for download on the original SEMROC site.

Just not the "new" kits that came out since the sale to eRockets.

[Initiator001]

When I spoke to Carl years ago about the SLS kits he told me they were low volume sellers.

For that reason he wasn't planning to release any more kits in the category (I was trying to get him to bring out the models from the 1972 Enerjet catalog).


Yeah, Carl spoiled us.

[astronwolf]

When I spoke to Carl years ago about the SLS kits he told me they were low volume sellers.

For that reason he wasn't planning to release any more kits in the category (I was trying to get him to bring out the models from the 1972 Enerjet catalog).


Yeah, Carl spoiled us.
There are a lot of cloning parts that have never appeared in a kit. The appearance of Enerjet clones like the Athena and Nike-Ram wouldn't be a surprise. All the parts including laser cut fins are already there.

[ghrocketman]

I worked a bit with Carl on the Enerjet Athena.
He was never able to find a reasonable source for the wraps for that one.
I have the one and only "prototype" of that kit from Carl, including the correct 1/100 S1B wraps.

[Jerry Irvine]

I worked a bit with Carl on the Enerjet Athena.
He was never able to find a reasonable source for the wraps for that one.
I have the one and only "prototype" of that kit from Carl, including the correct 1/100 S1B wraps.
Photos of a historical artifact!

[ghrocketman]

It is in a plain box without instructions.
Carl pieced it together for me when I reviewed his parts lists for the clone he was 90% ready to produce. The only items left to do were instructions and sourcing the wraps.
Not like it has a huge label stating "Enerjet Athena SLS prototype #1 from Carl"

[Sheryl@Semroc]

They're not discontinued as in you'll never see them again (and can't find the parts to clone them). They just aren't assembling the parts into kits that aren't moving fast enough to justify their shelf space (e.g. Earmark, which had no sales IINM in 2017, and others that sold only 4 kits (or so) in the same period of time).

If you want something that is OOP and out of stock, just use the instructions (which he's trying to figure out how to archive for free download), and order the parts (including decals) separately.

This is exactly the route Bruce and I were going to take. We were running out of space, as many of you know, "in house" meant exactly that. We had just about every room in our home plus the garage filled with rocket kits/parts. Carl and I had talked about doing this but he was reluctant, saying most people would rather buy the kit than individual parts.

[Royatl]

If I may ask, Sheryl, how many kits did you keep in inventory? The idea I got from Carl was that it was maybe 20-50 of big sellers and 0-5 of the slowest. That the idea was to be “just-in-time”.

[Jerry Irvine]

Looks like eRockets is discontinuing a lot of Semroc kits. I counted nearly 40 kits that are being phased out.
After >10 contacts wholesale and retail I describe it as a trend.

Carl is being "deprecated".

[Jerry Irvine]

Leave Sheryl alone. Take her to dinner!

[Royatl]

Leave Sheryl alone. Take her to dinner!

If my car could make it to North Carolina, I would!

[stefanj]

I lost my Explorer (scratch built, before Semroc) and might replace that.

Might pick up a Aero-Dart, Hustler, Lil' Hustler, and Scorpion as well. Not that I don't have a metric poop-ton of unbuilt kits around, but the old Mini-Max kits hold a special place in my heart. My initial clone efforts helped Carl put together the Aero-Dart and Hustler designs.

[ghrocketman]

I cloned the Hustler, Aero Dart, '72 Enerjet Aero Dart, and Enerjet Athena using Semroc parts prior to the kits existing.
First Semroc kits I built were the Scorpion, Jaguar, and Explorer.

[Sheryl@Semroc]

If I may ask, Sheryl, how many kits did you keep in inventory? The idea I got from Carl was that it was maybe 20-50 of big sellers and 0-5 of the slowest. That the idea was to be “just-in-time”.

We had at least 50 kits in stock of the big sellers, and at least 5 of the slower. We never ran out of kits. Carl would call me Scottie, I'd have a melt-down when we didn't have at least 5 in stock.

[Sheryl@Semroc]

Carl is being "deprecated".

I certainly hope not Jerry. As long as Randy keeps the names going (in parts), he won't lose the rights to those names. That's one reason Carl didn't want to discontinue the kits. You could order fins for just about any discontinued kit, that was another way to keep the name.

[Jerry Irvine]

Out of our 330+ kits we stock about 50 of them, just in time about 150, and OOP the rest as we prepare for our expansion this year.

Jerry

[Royatl]

They're not discontinued as in you'll never see them again (and can't find the parts to clone them). They just aren't assembling the parts into kits that aren't moving fast enough to justify their shelf space (e.g. Earmark, which had no sales IINM in 2017, and others that sold only 4 kits (or so) in the same period of time).

If you want something that is OOP and out of stock, just use the instructions (which he's trying to figure out how to archive for free download), and order the parts (including decals) separately.

If that's so, they shouldn't use the term "discontinued" and risk leaving money on the table. That's the whole spirit of "Just-in-time" manufacturing; only producing the kit when it is ordered. If you're going to keep around special parts for rockets (embossed wraps, laser cut stock, and special tubes for the Saturn, for example), just say they aren't available for immediate shipment, but are a custom order and take a little extra time.

[A Fish Named Wallyum]

If that's so, they shouldn't use the term "discontinued" and risk leaving money on the table. That's the whole spirit of "Just-in-time" manufacturing; only producing the kit when it is ordered. If you're going to keep around special parts for rockets (embossed wraps, laser cut stock, and special tubes for the Saturn, for example), just say they aren't available for immediate shipment, but are a custom order and take a little extra time.
I've seen the eRockets operation. Putting a kit together as it's ordered would take about ten minutes. Very compact and well organized. :cool:

[BEC]

One of the kits shown as being discontinued is the Aphelion. It's "just" a 3FNC, but it's a neat design and was (according to the info in the current - soon to be OOP - kit) the original Semroc's Alpha or Astro-1. (http://www.erockets.biz/semroc-flying-model-rocket-kit-aphelion-sem-kv-26-discontinued/)

I have one that I managed to get Carl to autograph at NSL in 2013. I built another to fly, and it took its 13th flight today (on a B6-4) as part of my New Years' Day flying. This is a cropped screen grab from the iPhone slow-mo video of that launch.

I'd pick up another one or two but I have five kits on hand (including #0016 from when Carl released it).

[Doug Sams]

I've seen the eRockets operation. Putting a kit together as it's ordered would take about ten minutes. Very compact and well organized. yea, it would seem the average small kit is better off made in batches that you can sell most of in a month or two. "Make as you sell" is only efficient for things that are large, semi-custom, and slower sell rateIt makes sense to me that kits using common parts could be assembled as ordered. Grab the cone, tubes and rings and put them in the bag. Send the instructions to the printer, and slap a sheet of balsa in the laser cutter, and then add them to the bag and put it in the shipping package.

Fast moving kits, if they even exist these days, could be assembled in batches and put into stock (or shipped to resellers).

Exotic and slow moving kits might be done as group orders sold via the web. That is, with today's connectivity via the forums, a vendor could propose a particular kit, give a minimum quantity and time frame, and then ship products a couple weeks later, assuming the minimum is met. That's basically what Gordy did with this kits, right?

The key point is, to avoid costly inventories of parts that don't move, kits using them would be sold in group order batches where the quantities are known up front and the participants are willing to wait the extra lead time for the custom bits to be fabricated and assembled.

If won't be the same as using on-hand parts, but, no doubt, with all the laser, CNC and 3D-printing technology in use nowadays, custom or semi-custom small batches seem very viable, no?

Doug

.

[astronwolf]

Exotic and slow moving kits might be done as group orders sold via the web. That is, with today's connectivity via the forums, a vendor could propose a particular kit, give a minimum quantity and time frame, and then ship products a couple weeks later, assuming the minimum is met. That's basically what Gordy did with this kits, right?

I don't completely agree with you there. This low buck JIT model may make logical sense, but then none of the ventures that follow this model have any staying power. Customer service is where it is at. Companies like Semroc, eRockets, ASP, and Apogee raise the bar for customer service. And that's where the current successful business trend in this hobby (and others) has gone and finally brought us. eRockets and Apogee are going to be or are putting their children through college with their businesses. Others aren't really making a living dabbling around with some kit offerings, and most will even tell you that they are not out to make a lot of money. And I'm not saying that dabbling around with some kit offering is a bad thing. We enjoy some nice products from the small mfgs. It's just not a business model that has a long term viability.

Sure there will always be people who generate a lot of interest in some product with some sort of "group order," for people willing to wait around forever to get their order. There's room in this world for this sort of hobbyists serving other hobbyists approach. But I'm done with the vaporware rocket companies of this world. I'd rather pay a realistic price for a real product and receive that product in a few days. In only rare cases will I agree to plunk down cash for an IOU.
-W

[Jerry Irvine]

Finished kits consume considerably more space that the component parts. That floor space cost seems to be the driver for JIT on some kits.

Estes has their product kitted in china, but when it arrives they ship it to distributors for them to warehouse. Solved.