Buck Rogers Thunderfighter Starfighter build

[dlazarus6660]

I came across the Centuri Buck Rogers Starfighter build thread this past W/E and I decided it was U-G-L-Y. So I did a little research for a paper Thunderfighter and found a fantastic model on a German site. I enlarged it a little(150%) and started building it. I plan to borrow as much as I can and use this paper model to make a flying model rocket. Depending on the size and weight, it will be either a LPR or MPR twin motors.

Germanpaper model site.

http://www.paperaviation.de/

Matt Gillard did a great job of cloning the Thunderfighter in EMRR

(http://www.rocketreviews.com/reviews..._fighter.shtml)

Based on his work and the German paper model I found, I intend to build the ultimate Thunderfighter Starfighter.
The Thunderrfighter was suppose to be the original Viper for the
TOS Battlestar Galactica.
See it here in the PaperModelers thread.

http://www.papermodelers.com/forum/alternate-dimensions/9847-buck-rogers-battlestar-galactica-star-thunder-fighter.html

I like the MKII version and I'll incorporate the modifications for stability.
Please feel free to give any input toward this build.

[luke strawwalker]

This fighter was used at least once that I know of in the Buck Rogers TV series-- in the episode "Happy Birthday, Buck" where it appeared as Cornell Traeger's starfighter prototype that he was captured in by an alien race 20 years before... apparently it was a 'prototype' for the Earth Forces Starfighter commonly seen in the show...

Doesn't surprise me that Glen Larson would have recycled some previous filming models that didn't get used on BSG for Buck Rogers... both shows suffered from insufficient effects budgets, so reusing old designs and models just made good sense (and which is why there were SO many "stock shots" used in both series, especially in space battles).

Later! OL JR :)

[AcroRay]

I happened to get an Estes '93 catalog a couple of weeks back, and saw that it offered what looks like the Centuri BR Starfighter done up in black instead of white, and renamed "Black Hawk" as part of the Explorer series (kit #2053), page 34.

Was that Estes re-issuing the Centuri kit?

[dlazarus6660]

I think so. I still think it looks ugly. Thats why I'm designing my own version.

[John Brohm]

I happened to get an Estes '93 catalog a couple of weeks back, and saw that it offered what looks like the Centuri BR Starfighter done up in black instead of white, and renamed "Black Hawk" as part of the Explorer series (kit #2053), page 34.

Was that Estes re-issuing the Centuri kit?

While the Black Hawk appears inspired by the Starfighter, it was a different kit and not a re-release. The Starfighter was based on Centuri parts (ST-8 body tubes) while the Black Hawk was based on Estes parts (BT-50 body tubes). Similar, but not the same.

The very same year that the Black Hawk was released (1991), Estes also released the Solar Probe (#2051). Like the Black Hawk, it too drew its inspiration from an older Centuri kit (the Photon Probe, KD-16), and was also kitted with Estes parts.

[luke strawwalker]

I happened to get an Estes '93 catalog a couple of weeks back, and saw that it offered what looks like the Centuri BR Starfighter done up in black instead of white, and renamed "Black Hawk" as part of the Explorer series (kit #2053), page 34.

Was that Estes re-issuing the Centuri kit?

Yep... probably the license expired from the studio, so they merely re-decorated the kit and released it under another name...

Later! OL JR :)

Don't see what's so ugly about it myself... but that's the nature of aesthetics...

[luke strawwalker]

While the Black Hawk appears inspired by the Starfighter, it was a different kit and not a re-release. The Starfighter was based on Centuri parts (ST-8 body tubes) while the Black Hawk was based on Estes parts (BT-50 body tubes). Similar, but not the same.

The very same year that the Black Hawk was released (1991), Estes also released the Solar Probe (#2051). Like the Black Hawk, it too drew its inspiration from an older Centuri kit (the Photon Probe, KD-16), and was also kitted with Estes parts.

Ok, that would make sense... Estes got the rights to all the Centuri designs I presume when they 'merged' (or Estes bought out Centuri but took their name or whatever back in the day) but Estes stuck with their own tube sizes, (except for the BT-56 I guess, which was originally a Centuri tube size IIRC) and so it'd make sense that they 're-engineer' any of the old Centuri designs they decided to reissue by using their own common Estes sized tubes...

Course licensing issues and all that probably still prevented them from making the kit along the lines of the Buck Rogers Earth Forces Starfighter... ya know, royalties and all that... LOL:)

Paint it black and call it something else, and come up with new decals and you're in the clear... LOL:) Later! OL JR :)

[CPMcGraw]

Found the 'original' version, or at least the BSG version of this design. It's the Naga class Viper (http://feggula.0dollarwebspace.com/bsgstarblazers/col-fi48.gif) , according to that BSG Starblazers list from the "Different BSG Starhound" thread.

That's an interesting list, dlazarus6660. Doesn't seem to have the Starhound variant mentioned in the eBay link, though.

[luke strawwalker]

I wonder about the stability of this design in a flying rocket though... with those big forward canards it's gonna take a TON of noseweight!

The original Centuri "Earth Forces Starfighter" model had a pair of fiberboard fins added onto the engine nacelles in the back... these fins were vertically straight up, 90 degrees to the delta 'winglets' on either side of the twin boom/pods of the vehicle, and opposite the ~45 degree lower 'elevons' on the bottom of the ship... I guess they figured the stability would be 'iffy' with the 'elevons' alone, since there were NO fins sticking out of the top of the original film models... and those lower elevons might not be particularly effective in controlling yaw, especially if the rocket pitched "nose down" and reduced the 'clean air' going over those fin surfaces in flight... so they added the extra pair of 'rudders' to the nacelles to improve yaw stability.

Good luck! OL JR :)

[dlazarus6660]

I wonder about the stability of this design in a flying rocket though... with those big forward canards it's gonna take a TON of noseweight! :)

Thats what Matt said to me.

[mycrofte]

Still cool to look at though...

[dlazarus6660]

Some more build pic's.
I got a little more done.

[dlazarus6660]

More pic's

[dlazarus6660]

I did a little more last night. Rudder Landing gear and rear parts.

[dlazarus6660]

More parts, more pic's
I completed the second motor/engine nozzle and both wings last night,
coincedently, while watching Buck Rogers in the 25th Century.
I have both nose cones and the cockpit to complete.

[jharding58]

Yep - interesting build. And all that surface detail and panel lines you don't have to paint....

[dlazarus6660]

Yep - interesting build. And all that surface detail and panel lines you don't have to paint....

I'm wondering how well all that detail is going to hold up under launch conditions. Quite often the grass is wet where I fly. I hope the ink can take clear coat.

[jharding58]

Dependent upon the cardstock weight. If you let the ink really dry into the stock prior to coating then it should be reasonably fixed. I have had to rush a couple in the past and there is a pale blue flush on the cardstock. Nothing really noticeable in direct sunlight, jus tunder bright incandescent and at an angle.

I have heard that the cardstock Semroc uses for the wraps with a glossy coat (Kromekote C1S cast coated stock) holds the ink more cleanly. Have yet to try printing on it though.

[dlazarus6660]

I use #110 cardstock weight mainly. I think I need to find a lesser weight cardstock for the nose cone part of this build.

[AcroRay]

Wow..... I've really impressed!

[dlazarus6660]

Wow..... I've really impressed!


Thank you!

[dlazarus6660]

A little more of my build.
I ran into a minor problem because of the lack of detailed instructions.
I overcame and persevered!

[dlazarus6660]

I have bee working on the nose cones using the #110 paper. I'm having a hard time rolling the paper to that narrow of a cone. I've tried using photo paper with the same results. It is the cutouts for the laser guns that are making it hard to stay conical.
I'm gonna take a break for a while and look for some different material to make the nose cones, short of using PNC.

[dlazarus6660]

I finally gave up and just went with what I had on the #110 cardstock.
It looks like crap close up, but who cares.
Anyway, it's finished. I need to attach a few fiddley bits and make the fin/rudders as soon as I get them.

[dlazarus6660]

I'm still waiting for the the designer to make to fin and canards.

[dlazarus6660]

I lift things up and put them down! (Said in an Arnold Schwarzenegger accent)
I keep picking this project up, look at it, and then put it down. There, I just did it again! :rolleyes:

[bernomatic]

I wonder about the stability of this design in a flying rocket though... with those big forward canards it's gonna take a TON of noseweight!
OL JR :)

The negative impact of the canards can be mitigated by allowing them to rotate.
Stick an "axle" in at the canard's CG then stick into the rocket. The Canards must be allowed to freely rotate, and this will negate the teh forward shift of the CP making additional nose weight unnecessary.

[jeffyjeep]

I built this Starfighter two years ago. I don't think it's ugly, personally. ;)

Hence:

[luke strawwalker]

The negative impact of the canards can be mitigated by allowing them to rotate.
Stick an "axle" in at the canard's CG then stick into the rocket. The Canards must be allowed to freely rotate, and this will negate the teh forward shift of the CP making additional nose weight unnecessary.

Actually you want the 'axle' as far forward on the canard as you can get it. Any surface area of the fin ahead of the axle still must count as a 'fixed canard' in determining the CP of the rocket. Ideally, if the axle is 100% in front of the canards, the effect of the canards on CP would then be "zero". Placing the axle at the quarter chord line of say a 1 inch square canard would still require you adding "fixed fins" 1/4 by 1 inch (the area ahead of the quarter chord line) to the rocksim simulation or barrowman method to determine the CP location of the rocket.

Hope this makes sense. OL JR :)

[dlazarus6660]

Everytime I hear the word Axle I think of this.

Axle Foly and Serge on youtube!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwsPp523Q9Q

[dlazarus6660]

I built this Starfighter two years ago. I don't think it's ugly, personally. ;)

Hence:


Jeff,

You did a beautiful job on your model.
I just don't like Estes rendidtion of this model.
That why I'm doing this build. Hopefully it will fly.
It reminds me of one of the gooney rockets, gone bad.

[jeffyjeep]

Thanks! I knew what you meant, actually.
I just can never pass up a chance to post photos. ;)

[dlazarus6660]

Thanks! I knew what you meant, actually.
I just can never pass up a chance to post photos. ;)

Well post away!

Has it flown? Any pics?

[jeffyjeep]

Unfortunately, it wasn't my kit. I only built it. :(

[dlazarus6660]

This build is like leftovers from Thanksgiving dinner.

I'm still picking at it!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAXo3Wr_nYU&feature=related

[dlazarus6660]

I'm still picking at this build and I'm on a minor crossroads. What to do about the nose cones?