Estes Wadding in its native state
 

I thought you guys might enjoy this. At the NARAM auction there were several bulk rolls of Estes wadding available. I had never actually seen one of these. I had heard that many years ago Vern had built an incredible contraption that would take a regular roll of toilet paper and, as it unrolled, run it through a chemical bath to flameproof it, and then roll it back up again.

The idea that you could do such a thing just amazes me, that you can treat wet toilet paper gently enough as it went through the process that it wouldn't tear.

Vern was at the auction and confirmed that that's how they used to do it, but that they don't do it that way any more. Now they dunk the entire rolls into a bath and then dry them out (bake them, let them dry naturally?).

These rolls are then unrolled to make the individual wadding packages that come with engine packs, or the bulkier packages sold seperately. I would love to know if that process is automated and if so, how the machine works.

And if anyone has photos of the old machine (did it have a name?) I would love to see it.

Steve

I switched to flame retardant cellulose insulation from Lowes/Home Depot 20 years ago. It's cheap, environmentally friendly, and one block of that stuff lasts a long time.

I used cellulose insulation exclusively for high power, but I don't really like it in model rocketry. The stuff is messy and I had one occasion where the small volume of material allowed gases to get by and melt the chute. I don't skimp on wadding so I know it was more a matter of density than depth. I've occasionally done a layer of paper under cellulose for BT-70 and up rockets that has worked well just to conserve the paper wadding, but it's still messy. The paper is clean, also biodegrades, and is part of the history of Estes. I'll stick with it for the small stuff. It's also reusable. After school launches I have the kids police the playground and save all the used wadding. You can't do that with cellulose. :cool:

Steve, I've made some wadding by soaking rolls. It didn't work well because I haven't found a brand locally that is as strong as the Estes stuff, vintage or new, and had trouble unrolling it. It took forever to dry so I'm guessing they had a drying process or just sat it outside in the low humidity and heat of Penrose. I had better luck with paper towels, but it just doesn't have the vintage vibe, much less the pliability. Yes, I can afford wadding, I just wanted to do it myself. :)

Since we are talking wadding, I've never cared for the Quest sheet style. The Estes TP is more pliable and seals much better for me.

Same here.

I treated a whole roll of paper towels with 7:3 boric acid / borax solution. I soaked the whole roll and then unrolled it over laundry drying racks.

I just ran out, and may do another roll. This time I'll boil the solution first, so it combines better.

I like using a sheet or two of Estes paper wadding (or, for big body tubes, my paper towels, cut in half or quarters) followed by some "dog barf" (cellulose insulation).

I think the machine was called "Mr. Whipple". :D

Now that's funny!

It is funny, and everyone here will get the reference.

Eighty percent of my office would need to have it explained.

You could "squeeze" in another reference or two and the young folk still won't get it. ;)

Please don't...

But I have two ply my skills...

Oh, Jeeze...

Now THAT'S funny!

Great Scott! :D We're on a roll! :D

I visited Estes in 1966 with a few of my rocket buddies. We saw the wadding machine. It reminded me of a taffy puller, with arms pulling TP thru a tray of the flame proofing solution, and then under a heat lamp, and wrapped back and forth by those arms. I may have taken a picture, but most of my slides of that visit were lost. I have a few pictures of the big rocket outside HQ, and the OP ladies processing the order we placed during the visit.

We saw Mabel making motors, and the nose cone grinder cranking out balsa nose cones. A truly amazing experience. Bill Simon was our tour guide.

I too have been making my own wadding, and I think the biggest issue is that I've been using good TP. I think I need to find the really cheap stuff like we had in school as kids! I dunk an entire roll, and let it dry for a few weeks. The outer layers are crusty, and get tossed, but the inside layers are pretty good -- just hard to separate. They are much more flameproof than Estes wadding, so my quest continues to find the ideal roll of TP.

I use 20 Mule Team Borax for my flameproofing solution, which is pretty cheap. I found mine at Walmart.

I wish they would sell it in roll form. My old fingers have a hard time separating those thin folded sheets.

Steve said he'd bid on a roll if Vern got up and told the story about the machine. How much did you pay for that roll Steve? :D

That's my standard method too. It forms a sort of piston. My favorite wadding back in the day was the Centuri "cotton ball" style wadding, but today it is Estes TP wadding.

LOL yes I did. And Vern told a great story. But I ended up getting outbid on that roll. It went for $22.

The best wadding I have ever used was made by Cox. I don't know how they made it but if I didn't know better it was treated Stridex facial pads, same texture, same size and thickness. It didn't burn at all. Many times it floated back close to the launch pad and I used them over and over.

They were great for a 1/100 scale Saturn V or 1B as the Cox pads were the same diameter and round. 1 pad/sheet per launch!

Randy
http://www.vernarockets.com
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00HHJHOK6
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00O14ET8K
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B01CX1UPCG

Back in the day, we just used REGULAR non-flame-proof toilet paper and paper towel as 'wadding'.
Yes we would let it 'smoulder' on the way down to the ground.
If it was 'smoking' or 'aflame' when it landed, we would just stomp it out.

I put out our football field when our technology teacher decided she would save money using Kleenex. Kids flew, recovered, and went back inside unsupervised. It burned down the full length of one sideline and out past mid-field for nearly half the length. I put it out with a cardboard box I pulled out of the dumpster. I just sat it on the ground and slid it along the leading edge of the fire with my foot. Meanwhile, the AP finally got our irrigation hose hooked up and ready to spray after I got it put out. That 300 ft of commercial grade 3/4" hose was heavy and he was soaked with sweat! :chuckle:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoHhzyh9kCg

Later! OL J R :)

PS. Bonus points--

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rnwvQgQZNE