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  #1  
Old 02-18-2017, 02:26 PM
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Default STUDY SUMMARY: Advanced Transportation Systems Study Technical Area-2

Here's another interesting story relating to the Space Exploration Initiative, the Advanced Transportation Systems Study done under the final contract of the Technical Area 2 studies relating to Heavy Lift Launch Vehicles, done by Lockheed Martin Missiles and Space Division for NASA in 1995. By that point the Space Exploration Initiative was well and truly dead, as the prescient final comments points out, and is worth reading the summary just for that... This points out that NASA just keeps studying and re-studying the same issues over and over again, looking for different answers, but the answers remain the same. Von Braun got it right. Saturn IB was just about right too... if they had put an F-1 on the thing rather than retiring them, we'd probably still be flying them.

Part of the study was researching options for 50,000 lb to 80,000 lb payload LEO launch vehicles. Various vehicles were studied including new hybrid rocket motors, various solid rocket booster options (predecessor to Ares I, which if anybody related to that effort would have read this study would realize they were barking up the wrong tree), and some liquid rocket motor options using "low cost" SSME's and the STME, even Russian engines... and most notably, the old classic F-1A and J-2S upper stage. Any guesses which performed best? That's right-- the good old F-1A and J-2S.

Of course part of the study was related to super Heavy Lift Launch Vehicles. Whereas earlier studies I already summarized focused on F-1A powered boosters with either F-1A powered or SSME/STME powered core stages, with SSME or J-2S powered upper stages, this study focused on mega-boosters using MASSIVE amounts of boosters from "NLS derived" vehicles... which, like Ares V, simply grew to enormous (and enormously expensive) proportions.

Anyway, it's an interesting read. What's the old definition of insanity?? Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result?? NASA has been studying various shuttle replacements for 30 years, and the answers are always the same. If you look at it strictly on technical merit (and throw out the silly "sunk costs" or stilted pricing figuring that NASA does (which is never accurate anyway, but is ALWAYS used to justify whatever pre-determined thing they want to build anyway, be it shuttle derived or whatever... These SEI studies, ESAS, the Augustine Commission, even the last time they studied it under the RAC-2 studies leading to SLS, the five F-1 engine serially staged J-2S upper stage rocket has always proven itself the better solution and less costly on a per-flight basis, even if "more expensive" to develop (which like I said, their numbers are always wrong in the end anyway... for what they spent on Ares I they could have built a new F-1A/J-2S booster and for what they've spent on the "entry level" SLS they could have revived Saturn V.

Anyway, here's the summary and pics. Enjoy! OL J R
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Old 02-18-2017, 02:33 PM
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1,2,3,4,5. Groundrules and constraints on the HLLV

6. Candidate configurations.

7. Conclusions.

8. Series burn HLLV groundrules and constraints...

9. Alternate tankage options...

10. Series burn alternative designs
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Old 02-18-2017, 02:43 PM
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1. HLLV ground ops...

2. FLO timeline for mixed fleet ops.

3. General sizing philosophy...

4. lunar mission parallel burn options.

5. pros/cons of HLLV using ASRB strap ons... Course they never did the math to show that the crawlers, pads, and VAB floor could never handle the weight of such massive clusters of SRM's, which all had to be moved fully fueled, unlike liquid fueled boosters fueled on the pad. Ares V soon ran into this glass ceiling itself when it tried switching from five segment boosters to six segment boosters and had to settle on 5.5 segment boosters instead and was maxing out the infrastructure then....

6. pros/cons of HLLV using LRB strap on boosters...

7,8. pros/cons of HLLV using multi-engine LRB boosters...

9. pros/cons of HLLV using large core and four LRB boosters...

10. Series burn configuration alternatives...
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Old 02-18-2017, 02:57 PM
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1. Series burn HLLV with multi-ASRB cluster... (which, again, would never work because it's too heavy for the KSC infrastructure...

2. Series burn HLLV using cluster of ET-size bosoters...

3. 38 foot diameter Saturn-Derived series stage booster...

4. 38 foot booster using Russian engines.

5. 38 foot booster using M-1 engines...

6. Alternate propellant tank design trades...

7. alternate propellant tank designs...

8. typical CAD drawing layouts to test gimbal angles/mounting interference...

9. 50K boosters to be used with the lunar HLLV...

10. propulsion options on the 50K rockets...
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Old 02-18-2017, 03:07 PM
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1. 50-80K engine specs...

2. structural weight vs. diameter...

3. structural weight as a function of diameter...

4. length as a function of diameter...

5. structural weight as a function of diameter...

6. weight as a function of upper stage propellant load...

7. length vs. upper stage propellant load...

8. first/second stage acceleration vs. upper stage propellant load...

9. vehicle configuration payload...

10. payload mass...
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Old 02-18-2017, 03:16 PM
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1. F-1A/ "low cost" SSME combination...

2. F-1A/ SSME combo...

3. F-1A/J-2S combo...

4. STME/STME combo...

5. LCSSME/LCSSME combo...

6. Hybrid motor combo...

7. Staged combustion hybrid/modified "rubber" SSME...

8. classical hybrid/"rubber" SSME combo...

9. classic hybrid/SSME combo...

10. classic hybrid/Vulcain combo... (shadows of the "Liberty Launcher"...)
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Old 02-18-2017, 03:20 PM
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1. ASRM derived launchers (shadows of Ares I).

2. ASRB/SSME combo (Ares I, before they realized that the SSME can't be airstarted without complete redesign).

3. ASRM/J-2S combo (Ares I, after they realized SSME can't be airstarted and they switched, but before they realized a single J-2S simply doesn't have the thrust to orbit an Orion by itself...

Later! OL J R
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Old 02-18-2017, 08:23 PM
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A few more studies, NASA will be able to stack all the reports and build a stairway to the moon.
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Old 02-20-2017, 07:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Campbell
A few more studies, NASA will be able to stack all the reports and build a stairway to the moon.


LOL Quite true...

Later! OL J R
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