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  #1  
Old 03-15-2018, 09:38 AM
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Default IRIS-T scratch build (was: paint and markings info wanted)

I'm scratchbuilding a sport-scale IRIS-T over on the other forum .

UPDATE: I will post brief summaries of the build to this thread. For full details see the TRF thread. Build updates start here

I have collected a lot of pictures of it from the web, but I still have some questions on the paint job and various letterings and serno plates. This is sport-scale so I'm not demanding everything be 100% accurate, but I'd like to do the best I can within reason. Was hoping someone here might have some insights.

The paint job I'm working in a hybrid of others I've seen, but most closely modeled after this one:
.

Here are some questions:
  1. Would the blue IRIS-T logo be on both sides or just the one? I've never seen a picture of both sides of the same missile.
  2. Between the main fins, just in front of the aft blue stripe, there's a "WARNING" box. Anyone know what the text might be in there?
  3. Anyone have any concrete info about the various serno plates all over the missile? I have a reasonable idea about the Guidance Section plate at front (shown in some pictures); the others I'm really guessing at at the moment.

If anyone has any info about this stuff or could point me to someone else who might, I'd appreciate it. I tried posting these questions on the Finescale Modelers forum but have gotten no responses so far.

Last edited by neil_w : 03-21-2018 at 09:32 PM.
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  #2  
Old 03-15-2018, 09:48 AM
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The logo won't be on any operational missile, just the ones that are on display or the mockups and demonstrators at air shows, etc. My guess is that the ones meant for "show" have it on both sides so it can be loaded on either side of the planes. Either that or they just do a mirror logo version for the opposite mount.



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  #3  
Old 03-15-2018, 09:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbzep
The logo won't be on any operational missile, just the ones that are on display or the mockups and demonstrators at air shows, etc. My guess is that the ones meant for "show" have it on both sides so it can be loaded on either side of the planes. Either that or they just do a mirror logo version for the opposite mount.

Yeah, I considered that possibility. I guess that it would look kind of goofy with logos on both sides, given that the logo is already near the top of the airframe to keep clear of the side... stuff.
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Old 03-15-2018, 09:48 PM
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Thank you for posting this! (It looks like large numbers of retired Sidewinder rocket motors may soon become available for sounding rocket use...) The IRIS-T is an historic missile, because it was developed to be a "drop-in replacement" for the venerable AIM-9 Sidewinder. (The Wikipedia article about the IRIS-T (see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRIS-T ) contains some interesting scale-related material:

It includes a video that shows--and well--the cylindrical infrared seeker moving (scanning) inside the transparent..."lidome?" (the optical equivalent of a radome, transparent to infrared--and also visible--light) nose cap. This would make an interesting Sun-seeker scale model, using a photocell, a solar cell, a photodiode, or a phototransistor as the optical sensor. Also:

A surface-launched, radar-guided IRIS-T variant, with a sub-caliber ogive/cylinder/transition forward section (see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRIS-T...IRIS-T_SL-2.jpg ), is also being developed. It comes in two versions, the IRIS-T SLS (short-range) and the IRIS-T SLM (medium-range). The IRIS-T can also be used as an air-to-surface missile (the Royal Norwegian Air Force has tested this capability), simply by using different software, and:

A navalized, fiber-optic-guided IRIS-T variant (with shorter-chord wings, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IDAS_(...le:BGT_IDAS.jpg ) for launch from German Navy submarines' torpedo tubes, called IDAS (Interactive Defence and Attack System for Submarines [the Wikipedia IDAS article can't be accessed via a posted link due to its URL's format]), is also under development. Four IDAS missiles will fit in each torpedo tube, stored in a magazine. With an official range of approximately 20 kilometers, IDAS will enable the launching submarines to engage enemy aircraft while submerged.
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Old 03-15-2018, 09:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackshire
It includes a video that shows--and well--the cylindrical infrared seeker moving (scanning) inside the transparent..."lidome?" (the optical equivalent of a radome, transparent to infrared--and also visible--light) nose cap.

Figuring out how to model that is taking an inordinate amount of my time. At my scale (BT55) nothing will move, but I'm going to take my best shot at making it look reasonable.

Quote:
A surface-launched, radar-guided IRIS-T variant, with a sub-caliber ogive/cylinder/transition forward section (see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRIS-T...IRIS-T_SL-2.jpg ), is also being developed. It comes in two versions, the IRIS-T SLS (short-range) and the IRIS-T SLM (medium-range).

The SL version is pretty spiffy too, I thought a bit about choosing it instead of the regular air-to-air version, but ultimately trying to do something with the nose seemed like fun. On the other hand, the SL would look more "realistic" launching vertically.

I'll leave it to someone else to model the SL, based on the way things are going so far one of these is going to be more than enough for me.
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Old 03-15-2018, 10:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neil_w
Figuring out how to model that is taking an inordinate amount of my time. At my scale (BT55) nothing will move, but I'm going to take my best shot at making it look reasonable.
One thought: In PSS (Power Scale Soaring, a variant of RC soaring--usually slope soaring--in which people build and fly gliding scale models of powered aircraft [with somewhat enlarged wings and tail surfaces, when necessary]), cockpit windows and canopies are often depicted as painted blue, green, or gray-green opaque objects. The Estes Space Shuttle kit and their foam Shuttle Orbiter used such decals (blue, if memory serves) to simulate the glass cockpit window panes. You could depict the IRIS-T's nose tip window like a PSS glider's cockpit windows or canopy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by neil_w
The SL version is pretty spiffy too, I thought a bit about choosing it instead of the regular air-to-air version, but ultimately trying to do something with the nose seemed like fun. On the other hand, the SL would look more "realistic" launching vertically.

I'll leave it to someone else to model the SL, based on the way things are going so far one of these is going to be more than enough for me.
The SL version does look pretty nice (rather sounding rocket-like). I know what you mean regarding "one and done" with demanding scale subjects (especially ones with conduits, like the IRIS-T) that require a lot of sanding and hand-fitting work to sculpt parts.
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Old 03-16-2018, 12:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neil_w
Here are some questions:

  1. Would the blue IRIS-T logo be on both sides or just the one? I've never seen a picture of both sides of the same missile.
  2. Between the main fins, just in front of the aft blue stripe, there's a "WARNING" box. Anyone know what the text might be in there?
  3. Anyone have any concrete info about the various serno plates all over the missile? I have a reasonable idea about the Guidance Section plate at front (shown in some pictures); the others I'm really guessing at at the moment.
Being a European missile, it's not one I've seen up close or know much about. But the photo you ask about is just a mock-up to show off at public events, so its markings are not representative of operational missiles.

Attached is a photo that may be more realistic, if you are interested in modeling an operational version. The warnings are fairly readable.

The one around the seeker dome reads: CAUTION NO SUPPORT OR HANDLING FORWARD OF THIS LINE

The one around the rocket motor reads: WARNING ROCKET MOTOR ARMED IF INDICATOR NOT GREEN

Also as a general note on ordnance markings, the two blue stripes in your photo indicate the round is inert. Note in the picture I posted the stripe around the warhead is yellow and the one around the motor is brown. These colors indicate live ordnance. Any bomb or missile component in blue markings is for display or training but is incapable of use in combat. At least that is the convention in the West.
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  #8  
Old 03-16-2018, 09:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackshire
One thought: In PSS [...] cockpit windows and canopies are often depicted as painted blue, green, or gray-green opaque objects.

That's what will happen if I admit defeat on the clear nose tip. But I am going to try *very very hard* to get the clear tip to work. I'm pretty sure I can do it, may not be perfect but I'll still feel better with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by eljefe
Attached is a photo that may be more realistic, if you are interested in modeling an operational version. The warnings are fairly readable.

That's a great photo, somehow one I hadn't seen among all the ones I had found so far. Where's it from?

Quote:
The one around the seeker dome reads: CAUTION NO SUPPORT OR HANDLING FORWARD OF THIS LINE

Yup, that one I had already.

Quote:
The one around the rocket motor reads: WARNING ROCKET MOTOR ARMED IF INDICATOR NOT GREEN

That's a new one for me.

Quote:
Also as a general note on ordnance markings, the two blue stripes in your photo indicate the round is inert. Note in the picture I posted the stripe around the warhead is yellow and the one around the motor is brown. These colors indicate live ordnance. Any bomb or missile component in blue markings is for display or training but is incapable of use in combat. At least that is the convention in the West.

Fantastic info, thanks! That's exactly the sort of thing I'm hoping to learn. I had seen some pics with the yellow and brown vs. some with the blue, but wasn't certain of the meaning.

I don't have any preconceived ideas whether it's more desirable to go with the operational or display paint. I guess I had sort of settled on the blue theme because I wanted to include the logo, probably gonna stay with it.

Any idea what the warning box might say between the main fins on my original picture?
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  #9  
Old 03-16-2018, 09:18 AM
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I certainly wouldn't encourage you to give up on the clear nose tip. There are clear (diisocyanate) polyurethane casting resins (the Por-A-Kast [originally made by SynAir Corporation] product line included--and may still--a clear resin, and PolyTek, Ciba-Geigy, and Alumilite [and/or other manufacturers] may offer clear casting resins). There are also epoxy casting resins, and clear ones may be available. Bare-Metal Foil also carries numerous resins and RTV mold-making rubber formulations. You could use the nose cone itself to create the nose tip mold, and the nose cone--or a shallow, hardened "pour" of resin poured into another nose cone of the same type, then removed--could (after being sprayed with a wax-based mold release compound) be used as the inner window mold plug.
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  #10  
Old 03-16-2018, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neil_w
That's a great photo, somehow one I hadn't seen among all the ones I had found so far. Where's it from?


It came up in an image search. Source is http://www.lima.com.my/saab-iris-t/

Quote:
Originally Posted by neil_w
Any idea what the warning box might say between the main fins on my original picture?


It doesn't seem to show up in any other photo, so I'm not sure. Since it's a mock up, here are a couple guesses on what it might say:

WARNING DO NOT LIFT BY THESE SURFACES

WARNING FOR DISPLAY ONLY
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