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  #11  
Old 10-09-2012, 04:40 PM
dannymrmissile dannymrmissile is offline
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Default Cmr Kit

Quote:
Originally Posted by A Fish Named Wallyum
This is a minimum diameter 18mm bird, 14.125" long, streamer recovered, with spin fins. No identifying marks other than a piece of tape that says "Sound Barrier Backup". It was an Ebay bird and I'm trying to find out if it was a commercially available kit, or if it was just a bird tossed together for max altitude and duration.






Hi-i see this post is about a week old, but i just saw it. I have a '71 CMR catalog in my lap now. This kit looks a lot like several of the kits you mentioned-except the catalog says they come with "pre formed PLASTIC fins". The shape of the fins favor the Rapier, but the BT dia is .890 " and are even with the bottom of the tube. The Effy has much broader fins than the one in your pics. Hope this helps (some), let me kno-i have many later versions of the catalogs & will look if needed. dan. oh-"pop" lugs were optional, not part of the kit. The 2 stage "HYPER" had plastic fins too-that go to bottom of tube also, and see none with spin fins.
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  #12  
Old 10-09-2012, 08:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Fish Named Wallyum



So might that be a year or a prior owner's NAR number on that fin?


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  #13  
Old 10-11-2012, 03:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dannymrmissile
Hi-i see this post is about a week old, but i just saw it. I have a '71 CMR catalog in my lap now. This kit looks a lot like several of the kits you mentioned-except the catalog says they come with "pre formed PLASTIC fins". The shape of the fins favor the Rapier, but the BT dia is .890 " and are even with the bottom of the tube. The Effy has much broader fins than the one in your pics. Hope this helps (some), let me kno-i have many later versions of the catalogs & will look if needed. dan. oh-"pop" lugs were optional, not part of the kit. The 2 stage "HYPER" had plastic fins too-that go to bottom of tube also, and see none with spin fins.

I checked both CMR catalogs at Ninfinger and the Effy was the only one that sounded close. I'm thinking that the spin fin setup might have just been something that this guy did to see if it worked, being a science teacher and all. I've never seen another CMR kit, so I'm just going on guesses. If you have any other possibilities, by all means let me know.
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I was SAM 0058

On the build floor: Centuri Stellar Hercules, Semroc SLS Scorpion, Semroc Squire, RDC V-Max

Ready to fly: Canaroc Green Hornet, Estes Astron Farside X, FSI Eos, FRW Magnum Spartan, Centuri Stellar StarLifter, Estes World Federation Star Probe, Estes Astron Apogee
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  #14  
Old 10-11-2012, 03:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Bill
So might that be a year or a prior owner's NAR number on that fin?


Bill

I'm thinking it's a year because one of the other birds I got also had a year on it. (I think it was the X-Wing.)
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Bill Eichelberger
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http://wallyum.blogspot.com/

I was SAM 0058

On the build floor: Centuri Stellar Hercules, Semroc SLS Scorpion, Semroc Squire, RDC V-Max

Ready to fly: Canaroc Green Hornet, Estes Astron Farside X, FSI Eos, FRW Magnum Spartan, Centuri Stellar StarLifter, Estes World Federation Star Probe, Estes Astron Apogee
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  #15  
Old 10-11-2012, 01:29 PM
dannymrmissile dannymrmissile is offline
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Question Plastic

Quote:
Originally Posted by A Fish Named Wallyum
I checked both CMR catalogs at Ninfinger and the Effy was the only one that sounded close. I'm thinking that the spin fin setup might have just been something that this guy did to see if it worked, being a science teacher and all. I've never seen another CMR kit, so I'm just going on guesses. If you have any other possibilities, by all means let me know.

One major question is are these fins PLASTIC ? The catalogs say they are. I will dig out my later CMR Cats. & see if there was any changes. One thing gives it away for sure, is the nose cone that was described by the other post. Those cones are paper thin and hollow, w/a tiny hole. And plastic cement would certainly craze or even melt them, as was mentioned. So if it has that, im sure its a CMR. BTW, I would NOT change or alter (fix up) the kit. Sure it would be fun to fly-but make a clone and save the Original you have-AS it IS! Thats what makes them more desireable. I just got a EARLY Estes scout . It is flown, burnt on bottom, etc.-but beautiful in it's own right, and have no plans to fix it up. These are my opinions-I restore old kits, but some are best left as is-yours is one of them. More as I look deeper. Oh-I still dont understand yet, about the fins NOT being even w/bottom of tube ??! , so leave it as it is....it is a NICE bird ! dan. PS- i just looked at the website posted on the kit-notice even there -the fins are EVEN with bottom of tube ! Urs are NOT......
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Last edited by dannymrmissile : 10-11-2012 at 01:41 PM. Reason: PS/spelling
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  #16  
Old 10-11-2012, 02:38 PM
dannymrmissile dannymrmissile is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dannymrmissile
One major question is are these fins PLASTIC ? The catalogs say they are. I will dig out my later CMR Cats. & see if there was any changes. One thing gives it away for sure, is the nose cone that was described by the other post. Those cones are paper thin and hollow, w/a tiny hole. And plastic cement would certainly craze or even melt them, as was mentioned. So if it has that, im sure its a CMR. BTW, I would NOT change or alter (fix up) the kit. Sure it would be fun to fly-but make a clone and save the Original you have-AS it IS! Thats what makes them more desireable. I just got a EARLY Estes scout . It is flown, burnt on bottom, etc.-but beautiful in it's own right, and have no plans to fix it up. These are my opinions-I restore old kits, but some are best left as is-yours is one of them. More as I look deeper. Oh-I still dont understand yet, about the fins NOT being even w/bottom of tube ??! , so leave it as it is....it is a NICE bird ! dan. PS- i just looked at the website posted on the kit-notice even there -the fins are EVEN with bottom of tube ! Urs are NOT......

I've gotten interested in this...just looked thru all my CMR catalogs, goin back to 1970. I Cannot find this kit listed as it is anywhere. I dont like to draw coclustions, as that ends the issues at hand for good. The best I can come up with is, the kit Favors the EFFY, most. Again, except for the fins being upwards from the end of BT. , I also can add, this must have been done by builder at his own choice, maybe it was modified for some reason in his way of thinking. Plus being canted. The other issue is the chrome tape around the tube. This Was offered in sheets by CMR, so dont know if strips were added to any kits. Fineally, take some nice calipers and measure the OD of body tube. Make sure its .736 (EFFY), or is it .766 (HYPER), or .890 (RAPIER) ? I doubt its the RAPIER, as it used the FSI 21mm engines. In any case, looks like one for the display case.! I'd keep it that way, but that's me...danny. ps-CMR made a Foxmitter 3 transmitter which offered a "Spin Rate Sensor Kit",,,maybe were getting closer...???!-but--Effy came with a Parachute...../// (some) CMR Streamers were chrome MYLAR,,, in 2", 4" & 6" wide-what type is yours ??? Is the shock cord rubber ?/// There were some pre cut plywood fins too,.../// cant find the words "sound barrier backup" ANYwhere...
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Last edited by dannymrmissile : 10-11-2012 at 03:12 PM. Reason: add
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  #17  
Old 10-11-2012, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dannymrmissile
I've gotten interested in this...just looked thru all my CMR catalogs, goin back to 1970. I Cannot find this kit listed as it is anywhere. I dont like to draw coclustions, as that ends the issues at hand for good. The best I can come up with is, the kit Favors the EFFY, most. Again, except for the fins being upwards from the end of BT. , I also can add, this must have been done by builder at his own choice, maybe it was modified for some reason in his way of thinking. Plus being canted. The other issue is the chrome tape around the tube. This Was offered in sheets by CMR, so dont know if strips were added to any kits. Fineally, take some nice calipers and measure the OD of body tube. Make sure its .736 (EFFY), or is it .766 (HYPER), or .890 (RAPIER) ? I doubt its the RAPIER, as it used the FSI 21mm engines. In any case, looks like one for the display case.! I'd keep it that way, but that's me...danny. ps-CMR made a Foxmitter 3 transmitter which offered a "Spin Rate Sensor Kit",,,maybe were getting closer...???!-but--Effy came with a Parachute...../// (some) CMR Streamers were chrome MYLAR,,, in 2", 4" & 6" wide-what type is yours ??? Is the shock cord rubber ?/// There were some pre cut plywood fins too,.../// cant find the words "sound barrier backup" ANYwhere...

The shock cord was rubber and the streamer is crepe. He put little notes on all of the rockets I bought, so I wouldn't think that "sound barrier backup" would be anything more than some kind of note to himself. One thing I can add is that the cone was obviously a two-piece, and built very light. There is a string that goes into the bottom of the cone through a small hole right in the middle of the base. Fins are pre-cut pluwood.
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On the build floor: Centuri Stellar Hercules, Semroc SLS Scorpion, Semroc Squire, RDC V-Max

Ready to fly: Canaroc Green Hornet, Estes Astron Farside X, FSI Eos, FRW Magnum Spartan, Centuri Stellar StarLifter, Estes World Federation Star Probe, Estes Astron Apogee
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  #18  
Old 10-11-2012, 04:17 PM
dannymrmissile dannymrmissile is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Fish Named Wallyum
The shock cord was rubber and the streamer is crepe. He put little notes on all of the rockets I bought, so I wouldn't think that "sound barrier backup" would be anything more than some kind of note to himself. One thing I can add is that the cone was obviously a two-piece, and built very light. There is a string that goes into the bottom of the cone through a small hole right in the middle of the base. Fins are pre-cut pluwood.

Just looked thru every catalog i have from "off brand" wannabee companies from the 80s up. The only thing close is from a company called Apogee Components (not the current one), only made a few min. dia tubes, there IS 1 in there like yours, but is an inch longer & uses pre cut fiberglass (called waferglass) fins... . Now, u saying the nc is 2 piece changes a lot. Since i put the cats. up-will have to get back out, dont remember seeing a 2 pc. from CMR. So-i'll check. Dont change the kit any, have you?---the sound barrier backup Could make a dif., as FSI made a kit designed to break the sound barrier, and advertised it proudly...
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Last edited by dannymrmissile : 10-11-2012 at 04:22 PM. Reason: add
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  #19  
Old 10-11-2012, 05:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dannymrmissile
Just looked thru every catalog i have from "off brand" wannabee companies from the 80s up. The only thing close is from a company called Apogee Components (not the current one), only made a few min. dia tubes, there IS 1 in there like yours, but is an inch longer & uses pre cut fiberglass (called waferglass) fins... . Now, u saying the nc is 2 piece changes a lot. Since i put the cats. up-will have to get back out, dont remember seeing a 2 pc. from CMR. So-i'll check. Dont change the kit any, have you?---the sound barrier backup Could make a dif., as FSI made a kit designed to break the sound barrier, and advertised it proudly...

The other rocket in the lot was an FSI Dart. Did FSI ever make a rocket with a plastic cone?
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Bill Eichelberger
NAR 79563

http://wallyum.blogspot.com/

I was SAM 0058

On the build floor: Centuri Stellar Hercules, Semroc SLS Scorpion, Semroc Squire, RDC V-Max

Ready to fly: Canaroc Green Hornet, Estes Astron Farside X, FSI Eos, FRW Magnum Spartan, Centuri Stellar StarLifter, Estes World Federation Star Probe, Estes Astron Apogee
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  #20  
Old 10-11-2012, 05:53 PM
dannymrmissile dannymrmissile is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Fish Named Wallyum
The other rocket in the lot was an FSI Dart. Did FSI ever make a rocket with a plastic cone?

How Strange you mentioned that-it is the Dart that was the one i was referring to, Sound Barrier ! You could get a bottom stage thruster seperately to make it go Super sonic. And most of the CMR kits were made to use FSI engines-thats why such odd sizes, -the .890 was a min. dia for the 21mm engines.,,of course the .736 bt-20 was used by all. I dont know of any plastic cones by FSI-but i will look. FSI is the 1st place i looked for yours. Can you also measure the wall thickness---.020, .040 , etc,,,what was the OD ? BTW-the Dart was a 27 mm engine kit ---FSI E & F engine.
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Last edited by dannymrmissile : 10-11-2012 at 05:54 PM. Reason: add
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