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  #21  
Old 10-15-2013, 06:53 PM
snaquin snaquin is offline
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When I got back to the car reminiscing about the almost 7 second burn time staged flight I had just witnessed, I began packing up my stuff since the Sonic 160 was to be my last flight of the day. When I was almost done packing and my back was to the range a guy I had met that morning that was only there to observe walked up behind me and tossed the sustainer in the back of my car!



He said he had witnessed the flight and from where he was standing was able to track it to the ground and went to recover it and brought it back to me. Although there was no problem with the streamer that was included with the kit, I prefer to fly with mylar streamers on those high flights so the sun can reflect off of the streamer for better visibility. He said he could only see the streamer and it aided in recovery. I've only lost one EnerJet model at that field and I use this recovery exclusively. Highly recommended and it is my personal preference. This time I used one of those mylar foil blankets cut to bout 6 feet x 2" wide but it tore pretty bad. I may try and use clear packing tape over one side next time to make it less likely to tear or try to find heavier mylar.

So, it will fly again! I wasn't going to risk my PerfectFlite Pnut altimeter but now wished I did. I'd love to have the data from that flight but I just couldn't bring myself to do it.

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🚀 In Paint & Detail: USR Banshee
🚀 In Build Queue: Estes Doorknob w/Vander-Burn Rocketry Upgrade Kit [Sport Decor], Semroc Centurion-F, Semroc Egg Crate
🚀 In Repair: SLS Lil’ Hustler, SLS Aero-Dart 1969 Trim
🚀 Stay Tuned For Fall 2021 Launch Dates

Last edited by snaquin : 10-15-2013 at 07:19 PM. Reason: Spelling
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  #22  
Old 10-15-2013, 07:16 PM
Jerry Irvine's Avatar
Jerry Irvine Jerry Irvine is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snaquin
So, it will fly again! I wasn't going to risk my PerfectFlite Pnut altimeter but now wished I did. I'd love to have the data from that flight but I just couldn't bring myself to do it.
Sonic Sounder with a CTI G and an altimeter and preferably an acceleration recording device for full data.
Quote:
Originally Posted by snaquin
It took a little over one wrap of tape around the F15-8 nozzle end where it acts as a coupler into the booster airframe and I made real sure it was a very snug fit into the sustainer airframe figuring if it ejected it would almost certainly drift out of our large field area even with a streamer for recovery.
A method we endorse (see AIR-3 report) is a tape thrust ring at the rear of the motor (with 3/4" extended for a stage coupler) and retain the motor with tape over the outside of the airframe and motor thrust ring.

Tech Jerry

Last edited by Jerry Irvine : 10-15-2013 at 07:33 PM.
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  #23  
Old 10-15-2013, 09:01 PM
stefanj stefanj is offline
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Thanks for the flight report!

The model looks really nicely done and I'm glad you got it back.
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  #24  
Old 10-15-2013, 09:08 PM
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Thanks for the report. There are only two places I have flown where I'd dare fly something like that - the sod farm north of Pasco and the Hudson Ranch (where NSL was this year and NARAM will be next year) - and then only under light winds.

That said, I'd love to have seen that Pnut data as well and I might just have to get one of these models from Rich O'Hara.
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  #25  
Old 10-17-2013, 04:07 PM
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Jerry Irvine Jerry Irvine is offline
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I don't see an online treatment of the USR motor installation method for staging so here is a page from a 1984 tech report.

Tech Jerry
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Last edited by Jerry Irvine : 10-18-2013 at 08:45 AM.
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  #26  
Old 10-17-2013, 05:53 PM
samb samb is offline
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Congrats on the flight and successful recovery. Especially nice when you have the good rocket folks backing you up. First I've heard of a -0 flight with the new motors, unless I'm forgetting a beta test report from jumpjet or Initiator001.
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  #27  
Old 10-18-2013, 08:56 PM
snaquin snaquin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Irvine
Sonic Sounder with a CTI G and an altimeter and preferably an acceleration recording device for full data.A method we endorse (see AIR-3 report) is a tape thrust ring at the rear of the motor (with 3/4" extended for a stage coupler) and retain the motor with tape over the outside of the airframe and motor thrust ring.

Tech Jerry


I checked Sonic Sounder with the CTI G (144-G65-WH) and checked it again with an AT G55-10W. The longest delay for the CTI motor is 7 seconds and it's screaming, really screaming so would require electronics for ejection. I don't have the CTI motor but I do have two of the AT motors in my range box I brought back from LDRS-XIII 1994 Wichita, KS that are still sealed in the bags. Requires between 1/2oz and 1oz of nose weight at the tip to be stable you can see the mass object in the screen print.



We're talking serious altitude with either one of those motor choices. Although the old WL propellant won't be easy to ignite ..... I think I have a plan.



Also, I did use the recommended method per the AIR-3 report on the booster. In the image you can see where I taped a thrust ring and then put one wrap of tape over the airframe and thrust ring to secure. Should have done the same on the sustainer but for some strange reason did not and friction fitted in the upper airframe with tape wrapped around the F15-8 to build up just a little to use as the coupler to the booster. Not sure why I did that ..... just nervous and in a rush to get it prepped I guess. They shut the range down about two hours after my flight when rain moved into the area and I really wanted to get this flight off.



.
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🚀 Stay Tuned For Fall 2021 Launch Dates

Last edited by snaquin : 10-18-2013 at 09:20 PM.
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  #28  
Old 10-18-2013, 09:15 PM
snaquin snaquin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stefanj
Thanks for the flight report!

The model looks really nicely done and I'm glad you got it back.


Thanks for the kind words Stefan. It was a real rush job but did come out better than expected, although the extra time I took on the Microc is evident. Not bad I guess that I started it on a Monday evening and flew it that Saturday.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BEC
Thanks for the report. There are only two places I have flown where I'd dare fly something like that - the sod farm north of Pasco and the Hudson Ranch (where NSL was this year and NARAM will be next year) - and then only under light winds.

That said, I'd love to have seen that Pnut data as well and I might just have to get one of these models from Rich O'Hara.


I may risk the altimeter on the next flight. I'd love to record, download and graph the flight data with the Pnut.

We are lucky to have use of a large field near Winnsboro, LA. other than that would surely need something large like the sod farm or the NSL site that you mentioned. With calm wind and streamers there isn't much drift if you are lucky enough like I was to get a fairly verticle flight.

Quote:
Originally Posted by samb
Congrats on the flight and successful recovery. Especially nice when you have the good rocket folks backing you up. First I've heard of a -0 flight with the new motors, unless I'm forgetting a beta test report from jumpjet or Initiator001.


These F15-0 engines were enough to get me up off my rump to start building two stage rockets to fly again and if it wouldn't have been for the guys tracking the flight it would have surely been lost. I gave up the sustainer for lost. The key is to not just have the guys on the flight line or near the pads tracking. Have at least one person pretty far down range to view the flight from a distance. A guy I had chatted with earlier in the spectator area where I had parked my car was the person that actually witnessed the entire staged flight and streamer recovery to the ground. No one nearby where I was standing saw it past maybe 3 or 4 seconds after the upper stage burn out. I really thought I was coming home with only the booster .....



.
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🚀 In Construction: Der Blue Maxx/Minie-Magg 5.5” & Vander-Burn MDRM Clone w/Stickershock23 Custom Decals
🚀 In Paint & Detail: USR Banshee
🚀 In Build Queue: Estes Doorknob w/Vander-Burn Rocketry Upgrade Kit [Sport Decor], Semroc Centurion-F, Semroc Egg Crate
🚀 In Repair: SLS Lil’ Hustler, SLS Aero-Dart 1969 Trim
🚀 Stay Tuned For Fall 2021 Launch Dates

Last edited by snaquin : 10-19-2013 at 07:31 AM. Reason: Added Image of Winnsboro Aerial Map Goldmine Plantation
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  #29  
Old 10-18-2013, 11:51 PM
Jerry Irvine's Avatar
Jerry Irvine Jerry Irvine is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snaquin
I checked Sonic Sounder with the AT G55-10W.
brought back from LDRS-XIII 1994 Wichita, KS
Requires between 1/2oz and 1oz of nose weight at the tip to be stable you can see the mass object in the screen print.

Also, I did use the recommended method per the AIR-3 report on the booster.
The actual motor has a much higher L/D than the sim shows. I was there. The photo I want to see is the upper and lower stage both prepped right to accept ANY LENGTH MOTOR.

Just Jerry
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  #30  
Old 10-19-2013, 11:07 AM
snaquin snaquin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Irvine
The actual motor has a much higher L/D than the sim shows. I was there. The photo I want to see is the upper and lower stage both prepped right to accept ANY LENGTH MOTOR.

Just Jerry


I will document that prep in detail when I return to launch the Sonic 36 again in Winnsboro next month. I am starting on the Sonic Sounder tonight.
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TRA# 677 L2
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SAM# 0052

🚀 In Construction: Der Blue Maxx/Minie-Magg 5.5” & Vander-Burn MDRM Clone w/Stickershock23 Custom Decals
🚀 In Paint & Detail: USR Banshee
🚀 In Build Queue: Estes Doorknob w/Vander-Burn Rocketry Upgrade Kit [Sport Decor], Semroc Centurion-F, Semroc Egg Crate
🚀 In Repair: SLS Lil’ Hustler, SLS Aero-Dart 1969 Trim
🚀 Stay Tuned For Fall 2021 Launch Dates
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