Ye Olde Rocket Forum

Go Back   Ye Olde Rocket Forum > The Golden Age of Model Rocketry > Model Rocket History
User Name
Password
Auctions Register FAQ Members List Calendar Today's Posts Search Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #31  
Old 06-28-2017, 10:43 AM
pterodactyl's Avatar
pterodactyl pterodactyl is offline
Opinions mine; not of NAR or MOF!
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 185
Default G. Harry Stine's Estes Camroc and Astron Delta

In the 21st Century, an era when HD images and video are commonplace, its easy to forget what the rocketeers of a half century ago had to work with. Overhead imagery wasn't a click away with Google maps and air travel was an expensive and luxurious experience. Consequently a significant segment of the population had never left the surface of the earth, let alone seen how their neighborhoods appeared from above.

Rocket cameras were the exclusive domain of experimenters and space professionals until Estes introduced the Camroc, which made its first catalog appearance in 1966. Today it appears very primitive, but in its day it represented a revolution to the hobby.



This is G. Harry Stine's example of the Estes Camroc atop its Astron Delta two stage carrier rocket as it appears today in the Museum of Flight's Inspiring Rockets exhibit. The model is built to Stine's high standard and features his mid-1960's use of fluorescent paint. There is also a bit of flight damage apparent on one of the fins; intentionally unrepaired in keeping with museum practice to retain relevant evidence of use.



Stine clearly did NOT want to lose this model, an indication of its rarity. Given the urbanized areas he flew during his time in New Canaan, CT he was wont to include return labels such as the one seen on this model.

__________________
National Collection Images: G. Harry Stine Collection/The Museum of Flight. Follow YOUR National Model and Sport Rocketry Collection on Twitter: @Natl_ModRoc_Col
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 06-30-2017, 06:57 PM
Vern Vern is offline
Founder, Estes Industries
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Canon City, CO
Posts: 17
Default

Just spent a couple hours going through document storage files looking back at how the Camroc came to be. In a mid 1962 Model Rocket News we let our mail order customers know we wanted to develop a camera to take aerial photos from a model rocket. In reviewing these old files I discovered a number of drawings and ideas our customers submitted. Ideas included ways to use an existing small camera manufactured in Japan, cameras that looked out the side of the rocket, one designed to be suspended from a parachute pointing down, etc. One idea had the rocket motor at the top of the rocket, with a tripod of wires suspending the camera below. Another young rocketeer submitted a drawing suggesting something similar to the design we were working on, which eventually became the Camroc. (Note: These, and other Estes files, will eventually end up in the archives at the MOF)

First Camroc Photo http://www.oldrocketforum.com/attac...tid=47324&stc=1

The prototype of the Camroc was first flown in 1964. The round negative for the first picture was hand-cut in the dark, without adequate guides or tooling to get a perfect cut. It was funny shaped, but the picture was clear, and we knew we were on our way. Of course there was still lots to be done. Injection molds had to be made for the plastic parts, equipment made in our machine shop to cut the round film disks, other parts ordered, darkroom processing set up to develop the film and print the photos, assembly instructions written, etc. Unfortunately, we way underestimated the time all of this would take, and as a result started promoting the future availability long before we could deliver. We were relieved when backorders finally went out the door in time for Christmas in 1965. Our policy of opening the morning mail, then shipping the same day had suffered a severe blow.

Later, when I gave Lee Piester some static over one of his products being delay for an extended time, he replied, “Well, we all have our Camroc”. Ouch!!
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:  1964 - First Camroc photo.jpg
Views: 80
Size:  103.0 KB  
__________________
Vern Estes
NAR member since 1958, #380
Click to go to Vern's web site: Vern Estes
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 06-30-2017, 07:16 PM
tbzep's Avatar
tbzep tbzep is offline
Dazed and Confused
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: TN
Posts: 8,375
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vern
Our policy of opening the morning mail, then shipping the same day had suffered a severe blow.


Mr. Estes, how long did Ms. Gleda process mail orders? I'm just curious if it's possible one of my early orders was filled by her.



.
__________________
I love sanding.
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 06-30-2017, 09:07 PM
stefanj stefanj is offline
Master Modeler
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Hillsboro, OR
Posts: 2,470
Default

That was great stuff, Vern!

The Camroc was one of the things that blew my little mind when I found a 1970 catalog at summer camp. I thought the adverts I had seen in Boys Life were bunk. (Mad Magazine had made me cynical.) But it was obvious from the catalog that there was a whole new real world there.


The crude-cut first Camroc photo must have appeared in a magazine. I remember noticing the contrast between the crude cut and the remarkably crisp image.

One thing would be cool to see is a floorplan of the old Estes buildings. I took the tour in 1990, when I think the packing facilities had moved to Canon City. There were still many shops; silk screening, and so on. And a room of local ladies making pre-assembled rockets for a special order.
__________________
NAR #27085 - Oregon Rocketry - SAM
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 07-01-2017, 10:14 AM
pterodactyl's Avatar
pterodactyl pterodactyl is offline
Opinions mine; not of NAR or MOF!
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 185
Default

Vern,
Thanks so much for digging through your old files to share this background information on the Camroc. We are very fortunate to have you as a participant on here.
Pat
__________________
National Collection Images: G. Harry Stine Collection/The Museum of Flight. Follow YOUR National Model and Sport Rocketry Collection on Twitter: @Natl_ModRoc_Col
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 07-01-2017, 11:54 AM
pterodactyl's Avatar
pterodactyl pterodactyl is offline
Opinions mine; not of NAR or MOF!
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 185
Default Happy Birthday Canada! Canaroc Industries

July 1, 2017 is Canada's sesquicentennial, although you don't hear that particular term used much in references to the country's 150th birthday.

Today it seems appropriate to discuss Canada's most successful early model rocket company, Canaroc Industries. Founded by the Lufkin family in Edmonton, Alberta in the early 1970's, the company featured an interesting selection of sport, scale, and competition model rockets.



Canaroc's founder and president Roger Lufkin had a background in industrial processes and brought his talents to bear overseeing the operation, while R&D relied heavily on the model rocket expertise of his eldest son Denis. Like many new companies the entire family got into the act and assisted with many aspects of Canaroc's operation.

Canaroc offered a line of Black Brant scale kits, from the Black Brant III, IV, and V. It's Orion was an efficient parachute and streamer duration competition model and the Nomad was a highly successful competition boost glider. Most of the competition models had their start as parts of Denis Lufkin's formidable competition arsenal which he flew at regional, national and international competitions through most of the first half of the 1970's.

A Canaroc Black Brant IV kit is seen here. Canaroc set the standard for Black Brant scale kits for many years. A complete set of Black Brant kits are found in the National Collection, and likely arrived on G. Harry Stine's doorstep as product samples.



Notably, Canaroc rocket engines were among the first 18mm composite motors available to consumers and featured a molded epoxy nozzle and plastic casing.
__________________
National Collection Images: G. Harry Stine Collection/The Museum of Flight. Follow YOUR National Model and Sport Rocketry Collection on Twitter: @Natl_ModRoc_Col
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 07-01-2017, 12:35 PM
LeeR's Avatar
LeeR LeeR is offline
Retired with Way Too Many Kits
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,593
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pterodactyl
earlier!
By any measure its a beautiful model build by "The Old Rocketeer". So who shall be the first among us to replicate this fine model?



Is the light color on the Ranger white, or gray?
__________________
Lee Reep
NAR 55948, L2

Projects: Mars Snooper, Viper
In the Paint/Detailing shop: Estes Saturn 1B, Red Nova, STM-Bandit, Honest John, Der Saturn Max
Completed!: Interceptor-E, Mini Honest John
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 07-01-2017, 12:43 PM
pterodactyl's Avatar
pterodactyl pterodactyl is offline
Opinions mine; not of NAR or MOF!
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 185
Default

Hello Lee,
Thanks for your question. I have not seen the model for a couple of years, but my recollection was that it was flat white with what is likely an age related color change to a subtle off white.
__________________
National Collection Images: G. Harry Stine Collection/The Museum of Flight. Follow YOUR National Model and Sport Rocketry Collection on Twitter: @Natl_ModRoc_Col
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 07-01-2017, 03:23 PM
GuyNoir's Avatar
GuyNoir GuyNoir is offline
NAR # 19250 - Life Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Woodstock, IL
Posts: 320
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vern


Vern,

One good Camroc photo deserves another. My one and only flight was back in 1968. I flew from the potato field next to our house. The flight path was pretty squirrelly but I sent the canister back in for developing anyway, not expecting a good picture.

Much to my surprise, I'd nailed a perfect picture of our house in Bloxom, VA.

Cheers, Bunny
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:  Camroc Pic 1968.jpg
Views: 71
Size:  790.4 KB  
__________________
A dark night in a city that knows how to keep its secrets. But high above the quiet streets on the 12th floor of the Acme Building, one man is still trying to find the answers to life's persistent questions. Guy Noir, Private Eye.
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 07-01-2017, 11:37 PM
LeeR's Avatar
LeeR LeeR is offline
Retired with Way Too Many Kits
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,593
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pterodactyl
Hello Lee,
Thanks for your question. I have not seen the model for a couple of years, but my recollection was that it was flat white with what is likely an age related color change to a subtle off white.


Thanks! It makes sense that it would have been white, I just wanted to make sure. I built a Ranger ns 1966. Would be fun to do another. Here is a copy of a slide showing part of my collection as a kid. A few kits, some Design of the Month builds, and a couple scratch-builds. I was a big fan of brushed Estes butyrate dope finishes.

Sadly, I built that Delta as the carrier for a Camroc. I just never managed to buy one due to lack of funds.

For some reason my copies of this slide got cropped. I cannot find the originals, and I'm sure there were a few more rockets to the right of that green/white Ranger.

Notice that I have almost all the rockets labeled with their names, using the Estes letters decal sheet.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:  IMG_0005.JPG
Views: 57
Size:  37.7 KB  
__________________
Lee Reep
NAR 55948, L2

Projects: Mars Snooper, Viper
In the Paint/Detailing shop: Estes Saturn 1B, Red Nova, STM-Bandit, Honest John, Der Saturn Max
Completed!: Interceptor-E, Mini Honest John

Last edited by LeeR : 07-02-2017 at 04:41 PM.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:11 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin Version 3.0.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Ye Olde Rocket Shoppe © 1998-2018