Ye Olde Rocket Forum

Go Back   Ye Olde Rocket Forum > The Golden Age of Model Rocketry > Model Rocket History
User Name
Password
Auctions Register FAQ Members List Calendar Today's Posts Search Mark Forums Read


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #11  
Old 04-25-2009, 11:56 AM
Jerry Irvine's Avatar
Jerry Irvine Jerry Irvine is offline
Freeform rocketry advocate.
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Claremont, CA "The intellectual capitol of the world."-WSJ
Posts: 3,452
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mn-rocketry
I can think of a few Estes products in the 1995-2000 time frame that were announced or appeared in catalogs or fliers, but then never became available.
#2030, Screaming Eagle rocket car (2000 flier)


Wasn't one of the announced rocket cars canceled due to a CPSC regulatory change proposal that was rejected after initially being out for comment?

Jerry
__________________
Exemptions not regulations. Please support DOT treating slow burning solids as not subject to HMR. 2015 NAR President declines!
U.S. Rockets instaship. http://bit.ly/1aca7mA Please buy some rockets.
The O administration believed in tax, spend, borrow, fine, mandate, monologue. D voters will soon be very happy with the election outcome!
Model rocketry is as safe as safe can be defined in human existence. Bow and pray: GH Stine, Orville, Vern, Lee, Lonnie, Carl, etc. No, really.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 04-25-2009, 12:42 PM
Gus's Avatar
Gus Gus is offline
7/21/61
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: North of Detroit
Posts: 1,784
Default

Mike,

Barry suggested the Shrox designs were cancelled due to stability concerns.

Can you elaborate?
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 04-25-2009, 02:03 PM
Bill's Avatar
Bill Bill is offline
I do not like Facebook
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: North Tejas
Posts: 2,474
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gus
Barry suggested the Shrox designs were cancelled due to stability concerns.



The rockets or the designer? <running and ducking>

I met Shrox at a NARCON and attended his session about designing model rockets hoping to gain some insight into what made his creative mind tick. Came away knowing less than before I started. I've got to find the tape of that session in my archives and watch it again.. Unfortunately, I may be too inhibited to come up with some of the things he does until I can find the off switch for the "nah, that cannot possibly work" warning mechanism.


Bill
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 04-26-2009, 10:34 AM
MDorffler MDorffler is offline
Craftsman
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canon City, CO
Posts: 100
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gus
Mike,

Barry suggested the Shrox designs were cancelled due to stability concerns.

Can you elaborate?


Gus - we did have stability problems with more than one of the designs Doug submitted. It was suggested we just add clay to the noses to correct the flight issues. Adding clay poses two probelem - the first being that some modelers will simply foget to add it during the build, meaning the stability issue isn't fixed, and secondly I personally dislike watching a 'stable' model ascend in a severe coning fashion. To me that's not stable.

My suggestions were to move the planforms rearward, and when that was done the models in question began flying straight. To do that did in fact alter Dougs graphic approach which in turn caused some differences of opinions back and forth. I wished we could have resolved those diofferences and produce the kits. But it was not to be as Barry made the decision to stop the project.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 04-26-2009, 10:37 AM
MDorffler MDorffler is offline
Craftsman
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canon City, CO
Posts: 100
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Irvine
Wasn't one of the announced rocket cars canceled due to a CPSC regulatory change proposal that was rejected after initially being out for comment?

Jerry


Jerry - not meant to sound as though I'm making excuses, but I really don't know the answer to your question. I would have to ask Mary R.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 04-29-2009, 11:00 AM
lurker01 lurker01 is offline
Craftsman
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 312
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MDorffler
This is interesting that at least one of the kits got out. It should not have happened. We had a contract with Disney that they were all to be destroyed.



Mike,

You would be SURPRISED what made it from the Estes Dumpsters and the Old Estes Home / Estes Storage to private collectors ... you would be surprised.

Hey, Bill Simon had said that last year he finally threw away boxes of Estes records detailing the number of Estes kits manufactured though the years.

You mentioned the Astrocam and that 50,000 units a year were produced ... wow!

How about those 1960's kits? Kits that had to have hand turned balsa nose cones and hand wound body tubes like the BT-30.

Any idea what the production number of a pre-damon kit was? How about the Cineroc? How many of those were produced annually?

Thanks in advance,

Bob
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 05-01-2009, 01:05 PM
MDorffler MDorffler is offline
Craftsman
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canon City, CO
Posts: 100
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lurker01
Mike,

You would be SURPRISED what made it from the Estes Dumpsters and the Old Estes Home / Estes Storage to private collectors ... you would be surprised.

Hey, Bill Simon had said that last year he finally threw away boxes of Estes records detailing the number of Estes kits manufactured though the years.

You mentioned the Astrocam and that 50,000 units a year were produced ... wow!

How about those 1960's kits? Kits that had to have hand turned balsa nose cones and hand wound body tubes like the BT-30.

Any idea what the production number of a pre-damon kit was? How about the Cineroc? How many of those were produced annually?

Thanks in advance,

Bob


Bob - no, I'm not surprised at all. And obviously you have intimate knowledge of where many of these items were kept or stored and were taken from. One thing I would like to pass on to the guys who have 'private collections' of Estes rockets, prototypes, photos, films, etc., is that in all likelyhood your collection contains one or more of these pilfered items. No employee has ever had the right or been given permission to take home items such as the original photo models, or kit files, or our large collection of scale data. Yet today the original models such as the Mars Lander or Spaceman, or the original Interceptor which were kept in the photo studio are now all gone. Most of the printing plates that printed the original instructions are all gone, and our massive set of scale files have been decimated. All of which has upset me greatly for some time.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 05-01-2009, 01:40 PM
GregGleason's Avatar
GregGleason GregGleason is offline
U.S. Manned Space Program Buff
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Houston
Posts: 1,297
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MDorffler
... have been decimated. All of which has upset me greatly for some time.


Oh Mike. This is terrible news. I had assumed that most of the Estes treasure was locked away safely somewhere. To hear that so much work and history was cast to the wind is very sad. Sigh.

Greg
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 05-01-2009, 01:45 PM
Ltvscout's Avatar
Ltvscout Ltvscout is offline
Ye Olde Rocket Shoppe
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 5,405
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregGleason
Oh Mike. This is terrible news. I had assumed that most of the Estes treasure was locked away safely somewhere. To hear that so much work and history was cast to the wind is very sad. Sigh.

From what Mike is saying it doesn't sound like a lot of this stuff was cast to the wind, but instead, taken without permission.

I was surprised to hear that items Mike had in his desk or office had magically disappeared over the years.

Stealing is stealing, folks.
__________________
Scott D. Hansen
Ye Olde Rocket Shoppe - Your One Stop BAR Shoppe!
Ye Olde Rocket Plans - OOP Rocket Plans From 38 Companies!
Ye Olde Rocket Forum
Ye Olde Rocket Auction
WOOSH NAR Section #558
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 05-01-2009, 05:54 PM
ManofSteele ManofSteele is offline
Level 5 Certified
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Sandy, UT
Posts: 160
Default Misisng stuff

I think Mike makes it sound like everything that left Estes was taken from his desk.

Not the case. Not by a longshot.

We had a number of the Laser Launchers that were sent out for evaluation as part of our marketing effort - that's how Sanford got one, and I distinctly remember sending a few others out to "lucky" rocketeers for testing.

In addition, we could've made the launch controllers - we had a large number of the chipsets fabricated - but, it didn't end up with the profit margins that Barry wanted, and it was dropped.


I understand there was a great "purge" of the old R&D offices before I got there, and a lot of stuff was taken home, rather than put in the dumpster for disposal.

Matt
Reply With Quote
Closed Thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:10 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin Version 3.0.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Ye Olde Rocket Shoppe 1998-2018