Cherokee-D

[Carl@Semroc]

Sheryl got ahead of me and released the Cherokee-D. I was going to wait until we had at least three to update the web pages. I have to try harder to stay ahead of her!

[BrianURocket]

Awesome. Keep it up Sheryl, and keep trying hard to stay ahead of her Carl ! I'll look at releases one at a time ! Just add them to my list to buy !

[kurth]

Great news. I will be getting one the next time I order!

Thanks Semroc!

[Crocodile]

Placed an order his afternoon. Carl -- You were waiting to have three kits. What are the other two?? :)

[Mark II]

Well, you can't keep a cat like that in the bag for too long... The Cherokee-D is a rocket that I have been meaning to build for longer than I can remember. Now it will be easier than ever.

[Bob H]

This looks like the pre-Damon short body tube version if my calculations are correct.

Overall length is 21.8" and a BNC 55AC nose cone is 5.4" which leaves a body tube length of 16.4".

Cool. :cool: I always liked the looks of the short version better.

I speculate that they used that body tube and cone because they were same ones that were in the Arcas kit and it was a good way to use up excess inventory.

Later on they went to a plastic cone and 18" body tube.

I guess I'll have to get one to go with my Cherokee-C

[Carl@Semroc]

I always liked the shorter version better as well. I thought that they went to the longer tube because of stability with the plastic nose cone, but Rocksim belies that. I think you are correct that they used up all the 16.4" tubes and reduced the number of separate parts to keep in nventory. The BT-55V was used in several kits, but the BT-55 was used in many more.

[jharding58]

Curiousity begs the quesiton - what is the subject of yoru avatar? One of yorus or another's?

[Carl@Semroc]

Curiousity begs the quesiton - what is the subject of yoru avatar? One of yorus or another's?
From original Semroc 1969 cover (http://www.semroc.com/documents/scans/semroc-1969-cover.jpg).

Never was built! It was based on DynaSoar.

[jharding58]

As you originally envisioned this, was the tube a constant diameter and then narrowed through the nosecone? Or did the airframe narrow from the tail cone to the nose?

[Carl@Semroc]

As you originally envisioned this, was the tube a constant diameter and then narrowed through the nosecone? Or did the airframe narrow from the tail cone to the nose?
It is conical. Photo from side attavhed. I have been meaning to put it in rocksim. It is in 3ds Max now.

[jharding58]

Something that you could come close with a BT-60 and cardstock fillets and a simple conic NC?

[PaulK]

Thanks Sheryl & Carl ! My all-time favorite. Even though I'm partial to the longer version, I'll have to get one of these. I see you've used a smaller than original chute, I can't imagine why! :rolleyes: (I'll still substitute a streamer.)

[Crocodile]

Cherokee-D arrived in the mail today. Oh did that ever bring back memories. Identical to the ones I build long ago and flew my first "D" flights. Lost every one of them when they landed in corn fields. Maybe can do better now.

Had to hunt for the decal sheet. At first I thought SEMROC left it out. ( not likely ) Found the decal sheet curled up inside the body tube.

Thank you SEMROC !!

[ghrocketman]

Cherokee-D's with D engines in ANY wind are recoverable generally only when using a streamer.
Use about a 90"x3" length of crepe paper.
With no wind, a 12" chute with a 4-6" spill hole works okay.
Forget the 18" chute; good way to lose one even on a C11.

[Quixote]

From original Semroc 1969 cover (http://www.semroc.com/documents/scans/semroc-1969-cover.jpg).

Never was built! It was based on DynaSoar.

So Carl, As a follow on your popular VF261, bet you would get massive interest in a "Carl's Fantasy 691" Boost Glider. ;) Think it looks awesome.

Garth Illerbrun
SAM 20
CAR S04
TRA 817

[A Fish Named Wallyum]

Cherokee-D's with D engines in ANY wind are recoverable generally only when using a streamer.
Use about a 90"x3" length of crepe paper.
With no wind, a 12" chute with a 4-6" spill hole works okay.
Forget the 18" chute; good way to lose one even on a C11.

I cloned one back in 2001 that I flew on C11s and D12s, then built a Thrustline clone that I flew on mostly D12s. The one I built myself suffered a CATO on the D12 flight, my first ever, that cleaned out the engine mount for me. Since I had the Thrustline kit by then I put an E mount in the original clone and did manage to lose it on the first flight, but only because I was flying in serious wind. Never had a problem recovering them at VOA with a reefed 18" chute. Some of the walks were like day hikes, but my Thrustline bird is out in the shop now with a damaged nose cone from rebounding into the body tube. Otherwise, it's flyable. :cool:

[ghrocketman]

My whole point is using a 18" chute, reefed or NOT, is IDIOTIC on a rocket that weighs 2.5 oz sans propellant. TOTAL NONSENSE.
I have a vintage black-and-orange Estes checkerboard 12" chute in my Thrustline clone Cherokee-D and it will never fly with that on a D engine unless dead calm.

[Doug Sams]

...I put an E mount in the original clone and did manage to lose it on the first flight, but only because I was flying in serious wind. I'm assuming it weathercocked badly, no?

When I cooked up my 3-stage Uber Tuber, on its first flight, I had only a single D12 in the 1st stage. It crawled off the rod. By the time the 3rd stage lit, it was horizontal in the sky. It went way down range. But the good thing was, I was using a mylar streamer. Don Magness and I recovered it after a good long walk.

Those mylar streamers are amazingly helpful when you're pushing the limits. The glint of light reflecting off them makes them much easier to track at long ranges. So having the right amount drag in the recovery system is only part of the solution. Having a shiny, reflective streamer is another key part.

Doug...too bad they don't make mylar golf balls...;)

.

[A Fish Named Wallyum]

My whole point is using a 18" chute, reefed or NOT, is IDIOTIC on a rocket that weighs 2.5 oz sans propellant. TOTAL NONSENSE.

I'll write that down. :rolleyes:

[A Fish Named Wallyum]

I'm assuming it weathercocked badly, no?

When I cooked up my 3-stage Uber Tuber, on its first flight, I had only a single D12 in the 1st stage. It crawled off the rod. By the time the 3rd stage lit, it was horizontal in the sky. It went way down range. But the good thing was, I was using a mylar streamer. Don Magness and I recovered it after a good long walk.

Those mylar streamers are amazingly helpful when you're pushing the limits. The glint of light reflecting off them makes them much easier to track at long ranges. So having the right amount drag in the recovery system is only part of the solution. Having a shiny, reflective streamer is another key part.

Doug...too bad they don't make mylar golf balls...;)

.
Well, it weren't goodly, that's for sure. :D We happened to be flying down near the southern edge of the VOA on that day. It initially headed for the south, then caught the breeze and took off to the north. It looked like it might have stayed inside the park, but I was pretty far behind it, so it was difficult to tell. I drove out and followed the line about a 1/4 mile in each direction inside and outside of the park, but never found it. Just another contribution to the VOA greenery on my part. ;)

[Tau Zero]

I'll write that down. :rolleyes:So you can remember not to do it, or so you remember to try it?

--Just coverin' for ya. :eek: :rolleyes: ;) :D


Hmm, what if I upscale an Estes Drifter to humongous SLS dimensions, and then stuff a cargo chute inside? (walks away doing some serious figuring...)
.

[A Fish Named Wallyum]

So you can remember not to do it, or so you remember to try it?

--Just coverin' for ya. :eek: :rolleyes: ;) :D


Hmm, what if I upscale an Estes Drifter to humongous SLS dimensions, and then stuff a cargo chute inside? (walks away doing some serious figuring...)
.
(Pssst. I just said that to humor him. See? He's quiet now. :D )

[Tau Zero]

(Pssst. I just said that to humor him. See? He's quiet now. :D )Zzzzzzz.
.

[Mark II]

Zzzzzzz.
.[Ssshhhsssss.....don't wake him!]

[blackshire]

Using three of the new Estes 6" parachutes (reefed if necessary, although such small 'chutes might not need it) would give the Cherokee-D a stately "Apolloesque" appearance during descent without making it drift too far. They would also give it some redundancy, in the event one of the 'chutes failed to open.

[ghrocketman]

Alright, ya bunch o' smart-alecks.... :chuckle:

Actually the reason I said that is that I have lost more Cherokee-D's five-fold to any other rocket.
At least 3 on 18" chutes, and at least 2 on 12".
Streamers only on that one for me now....

The Estes Skybolt actually weighed MORE, but had streamer recovery STOCK !

Anything "D" powered that weighs less than an Astron Renegade, I equip with a streamer or a 12" chute with a BIG spill hole.

[sandman]

Alright, ya bunch o' smart-alecks.... :chuckle:

Actually the reason I said that is that I have lost more Cherokee-D's five-fold to any other rocket.
At least 3 on 18" chutes, and at least 2 on 12".
Streamers only on that one for me now....

The Estes Skybolt actually weighed MORE, but had streamer recovery STOCK !

Anything "D" powered that weighs less than an Astron Renegade, I equip with a streamer or a 12" chute with a BIG spill hole.

I have that one beat!

I lost my last Cherokee D at NARAM 47 with just a nose blow ejection...no chute or streamer and it drifted away!

[ghrocketman]

Sandman, that DEFINITELY beats me !
What was the motor ?
I did not know one could lose one due to drift with "nose-blow" recovery !
Those must have been some HIGH winds !

For some reason I always lost them on D12-7's....NEVER any other motor....not on D12-5, D11-9, C11-5, B6-4, or C6-5's.
Never used over a D in one...the E9 would most certainly increase the chance of loss.

[sandman]

Sandman, that DEFINITELY beats me !
What was the motor ?
I did not know one could lose one due to drift with "nose-blow" recovery !
Those must have been some HIGH winds !

For some reason I always lost them on D12-7's....NEVER any other motor....not on D12-5, D11-9, C11-5, B6-4, or C6-5's.
Never used over a D in one...the E9 would most certainly increase the chance of loss.


:o Yes...a D12-7... :o

[kurth]

My Cherokee D just showed up in the white box of happiness. I can not wait to get started!

[Bob H]

My Cherokee D just showed up in the white box of happiness. I can not wait to get started!Hmm.. "White Box of Happiness", I like that!

[ghrocketman]

Sandman- almost already knew what motor it had to be before you said it.