Tomahawk paint questions (Ute Tomahawk)
 

So, I'm working on painting plans for my sport scale Ute Tomahawk / Big Daddy-Ventris-Argent kitbash.

I'm working from the brochure that the attached image came from.


I've scoured the web and the other forum (including all the Nike Tomahawk photos upload by High Visibility Dave) and have some thoughts/questions:

1) Do folks think this round was even painted? Is it all bare metal? If so, why are the Ute fins a different shade from the Tomahawk fins. Could the Ute be the white/black/red theme seen on at least one display N-T?
2) Was the Thiokol logo ever painted on the tomahawk motor - like it was on at least the Keweenaw Range Apaches?
3) Does anyone have photos of a Tomahawk with the 12" payload bay? I'm prepping to fly with either payload - even though the fins are slightly bigger on the 12" version. That's one reason I'm calling it 'sport' scale :-)

Here's a little more detail. Looks painted to me, but the colors are anybody's guess..........

file:///Users/joewarner/Downloads/UteTomahawk.pdf

Hope this might help.

Thanks fellows. I do have that one in my collection.

Mark Bundick, who posts here fairly frequently, modeled this vehicle back in the mid-70s for a NARAM (maybe NARAM-17 in Orlando). I seem to remember a photo of him in one of the Centuri "Rocket Times" issues from 1976 holding the model in his hands.

Maybe he can chime in and provide some details.

Earl

I have a hard time believing it’s such an unpopular rocket to scale.

It took me a bit to find a spot in the house with a ceiling high enough to recreate the Thiokol photo.



And some of my detailing. Not going after rivet level accuracy.

You have a good memory, Earl!

The Ute-Tomahawk was indeed flown by the Bundick-Justis Team at NARAM-17 in Orlando. It was built by my teammate, Rob Justis. His dad got drawings and photo of the prototype for us. Sadly, I don't have that data, but will check with Rob to see if he does.

My recollection of the model was that the boosters were a mixture of gray tone. There was a script Thiokol on the Ute, but don't hold me to that. The payload was a mixture of silver colors, typical of Wallops payloads back in the day.

I'll let folks here know what I find out from Rob.

Comrade Noir,

A drawing would be great. That would be fun-size in 1/10th scale.

More info would be great.

I'm happy with my 1/5 scale PSII kitbash so far. 1/10th would be what, BT58 to BT50? Would you try to make it 2 stage?

Charles, that’s a great looking rocket. I had never heard of it until your post.

I’ll be anxious to see it finished, in whatever color it ends up. :)

High Visibility Dave provided a little more info on The Forum That Shall Not Be Named. Including this:

Actually, I’m only assuming that EZ2C means highly visible. It’s possible that he’s claiming to have zero rest mass, so he can accelerate to the speed of light.

Comrades:

Attached is a drawing I created using the artwork in an earlier post. It would be a 1/10 scale Ute. The transition seems to be similiar in shape to a Semroc Nike-Tomahawk but it would need the larger end resized to fit a Series 15/BT-58 body tube. If the transition was drilled out for a BT-50 tube, then staging would be possible. As scale staging projects go, this would seem like a good choice.

As noted on the drawing, the Semroc I.Q.S.Y. Tomahawk could be used as a starting point for the second stage.

The boattail could be paper or balsa. Paper would seem to be preferable if you build as a two-stage.

I'd build it. (if someone would turn the transition . . . .)

Mark,

Got my "fingers crossed", in hopes that the data is still available . . .

Sorry. Nothing to report.

This paint job fought me every step of the way. I’m calling it done.
So here’s my fanciful take on a Ute Tomahawk.
1/5 scale, roughly. 38mm to 29mm. Kitbashed from a Big Daddy, a Ventris, and an Argent.

It was definitely worth the trouble. That really looks super!
I'm having a tough paint week too. :)

Looks great !
I'd buy that as a kit.

We'll see how it flies.

Here's an example of the painting problems.
Bad paint day. by Charles McGonegal, on Flickr

I guess I still need to work on my surface prep. The payload went better.

I don't have a closeup on the fins - but the leading edges did the same thing. I sanded them to a really sharp leading edge, and then CA coated that edge to help (I hope) avoid chipping. But Rusto Painters Touch just doesn't want to stick to the CA.

I never have paint problems on models when using "Hobby Brand" paints such as Testors, Tamiya, Pactra, Brodak, Sig, etc. I only have issues when using "Hardware store" brands such as Krylon, Rust-Oleum, Wal-Mutt Cheap-O stuff, etc.

Yes . . .

Note the different fins.

Dave F.

And I don’t think those are the fins shown in the Tomahawk brochure I have. Hmmm...

I’m wondering if I can print up something that screws to the fins I have now and converts them.

I also wonder what the round dark spot it. It looks like it’s surrounded by 6 screws and has a wire coming out of it. Part of a despin unit?

And lastly, in my book, hanging off the nosecone of a sounding rocket ranks right up there with look down waveguide.

Hope this scale data helps.

There is dimensioned data on the 12" payload variation of the Nike-Tomahawk available.

http://cv41.org/newsletters/V18I3.pdf

I don't believe that the "round dark spot" is part of a de-spin unit. Most likely, it is some sort of sensor or, possibly, a camera of some type.

On the "standard" Nike -Tomahawk, a "yo-yo" de-spin unit is mounted between the motor and the payload section.

Thank Jerry. That’s the info I based my model on.

But I have leftover parts from the kitbashing. Just the right parts for a scale 12” payload. I have line drawings of the 12” payload from a period brochure - but had not seen pictures until now. Thanks Dave.

Now, a Ute Tomahawk may never have flown the 12” payload. I’m not sure I care. And I -DO- happen to have a Nike that the Ute nosecone/interstage should fit. So the paint scheme won’t match (my Nike is marked with the Keweenaw Range round numbers. I’m an MTU alum) but I’m not always picky.

Would you please send me a copy of that brochure ?

Ez2cDave@aol.com

Thanks, in advance !

Dave F.

Sent. and posted.

I did pick up some tricks from you for this build, Jerry:
How I did the boat tail.

Ute boat tail layout by Charles McGonegal, on Flickr

Ute boat tail cut by Charles McGonegal, on Flickr

You can just see in this picture that I added a short piece of 2.5" tubing (or maybe coupler) to the aft centering ring to provide more surface area to glue. It still slipped a little, so the gaps aft of the fins aren't even all the way around.

Ute fins by Charles McGonegal, on Flickr

Ute booster by Charles McGonegal, on Flickr

When I looked at your build photos I was thinking both booster shrouds could be done using Integrated Tube-tm and a fairly easy sport scale kit would emerge. It looked to me like your interstage reducer was a traditional shroud. If it were me and a smooth surface was a priority, i would put a traditional shroud over an IT-tm shroud for strength and stage coupling.

Jerry

Interesting thought with the layering. Mine is foam filled.

!
 

Charles,

Thank you, sir !

Dave F.

CTI G78-B CATO on first flight.
Damage to sustainer when it hit the ground.

Photo courtesy Kevin Harnack.

Ugh.
Major bummer.
Shoulda used Aerotech....

On the pad.



In the air. (credit to Kevin Harnack)

I've been reading a lot about CTI catos. They supposedly sent out a bulletin about a fix to their distributors. After some of the stuff I've read, I don't think I'll ever use their stuff.

Allen

The photo above was a replacement CTI Pro38 1G G78 blue streak. It staged to a CTI Pro24 1G E22 Smokey Sam.

I like the starter pellets in the CTI motors - especially for sustainers. They light easily with an ematch - well within the capabilities of LiPo powered altimeters.

I still have at least one motor - a G115 White Thunder - that has a starter pellet from the faulty batch. I'll cut it in half as instructed and carry on.

I'll criticize CTI for not doing their own quality control on vendor supplies parts/materials. This is the second time in my few years of flying (it looks like I'm 6 years a BAR) that CTI has been bitten by trusting their suppliers. They're not alone - it's happened to SpaceX, too - but still...

UTE-TOMAHAWK and PAIUTE-TOMAHAWK info . . .

TRUST, but VERIFY !